You are not logged in.
#26 2006-06-22 05:01:32
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
I now want to move on from 'What is a "Trad"' & 'Why is A "Trad"' to the clothes -
More and more I'm reading about a very constricted wardrobe of choices for this style of dress. There seems to be a strong need for orthodoxy and 'rules' in this look. The more I read the more I detect the need for a prescription that can be taken to the tailor or shirtmaker to give you the identity that you are looking for.
"WHY?" - is, I suppose, my question here.
Again, to reiterate, No point to make here just eager to understand and I do love Ivy clothes.
Miles.
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#27 2006-06-22 07:40:58
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
I don't know who you are, but I want to make one thing clear - when JS hand painted that sign he was thinking of TAC (Traditional American Clothing) the father of CAD (Classic American Dressing) - TRAD (... Nope can't think of anything at the moment...) never came in to it.
1981 was a more innocent age...
Miley.
Hmmm - "TRAD"... Terribly Refined American... Nope, still can't do it...)
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#28 2006-06-23 02:07:57
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
Just an add-on question to my last one:
WHEN did the "Trad" rule-book come into play? When did the style solidify into its codified state? Is there a date we can put on this? When were darts etc., decreed out of the cannon? (Not that I greatly like darts, but when did they start to be considered totally unacceptable & by whom?)
M.
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#29 2006-06-23 04:05:40
- Horace
- Member
- Posts: 6432
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.
#30 2006-06-23 04:08:04
- Horace
- Member
- Posts: 6432
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.
#31 2006-06-23 04:17:54
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
But why the need for the 'rule book' ?
Why the obsession with orthodoxy?
English 'Trad' does not have this. It is totally alien to my experience of how the 'upper classes' dress anywhere else in the world.
Nothing wrong with having a codified 'look', but WHY have one?
M.
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#32 2006-06-23 04:28:07
- Horace
- Member
- Posts: 6432
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.
#33 2006-06-23 05:58:51
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
Hmmmmm -
I see your point... but I don't see many other 'Trad' rebels out there.
Just a POV but what I'm seeing is something more like tribal teenage fashion the more I consider it...
Being a Mod.
Being a Skin.
Being a Ted.
Being a Trad.
Am I way off?
If I broke into their houses & stole their clothes then who & what would they be?
My brothers, obviously, and God's children... but more than that...?
M.
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#34 2006-06-23 13:32:21
- Horace
- Member
- Posts: 6432
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.
#36 2006-06-23 15:45:15
- Horace
- Member
- Posts: 6432
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.
#37 2006-06-24 00:26:08
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
Hmmmmm - (Again) -
Rebelling into orthodxy makes sense & I like the concept.
This implies making a stylistic choice which is what I think "Trad" is.
My problem is when the "Trad" identity is presented as being MORE than just a fondness for a certain style in whatever (Clothes, houses, dogs, cars etc.)... It's when the presentation changes from "I like that whole WASPy, Ivy, Brahmin look & way of life" to "I AM a WASPy, Ivy, Brahmin" when in fact you're actually not. It is at that point that things start to go wrong for me in my appreciation of this style.
Lucky Strike's previous points about the class pretentions that "Trad" is currently carrying come into this.
I've no problem with genuine WASPs, Brahmins, Fogeys etc., but the strange 'wannabe' element and snobbery within "Trad-ism" is something that I think needs to be policed to stop it ruining what could be a wonderful stylistic movement.
I'm hoping that all "Trads" will agree with this.
Miles
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.
#38 2006-06-24 11:33:00
- Coolidge
- Member
- Posts: 1192
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
Last edited by Coolidge (2006-06-24 11:34:28)
#39 2006-06-24 11:55:11
- Miles Away
- Member
- From: Miles away
- Posts: 1180
Re: Ask Horace About Trad (AHAT)
How I wish I'd never pulled your leg as 'Chet'...
Thank you for that - honest, well considered & intelligent. A real contribution to the whole debate.
Miles.
" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.