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#1 2012-05-03 03:52:38
- Hard Bop Hank
- Ivy Soul Brother
- From: land of a 1000 dances
- Posts: 4567
Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
I have no idea when they became popular.
They must be older than Ivy, definitely before the first Brooks #1 sack ca. 1917. I think they were a feature of American, British and Continental sack suits during the Edwardian era, and at least late Victorian...
Yesterday a friend send me this picture of a young Gustav Landauer, a German writer who was murdered 93 years ago:
Apparently, taken by Oscar Suck in 1892.
Of course, this might as well be a 4/3 roll, you can't tell for sure, but the top button is quite high and as far as I know four button sack suits were quite popular at the end of the 19th century, beginning of the 20th century...
“No Room For Squares”
”All political art is bad – all good art is political.”
"Would there be any freedom of press or speech if one must reduce his vocabulary to vapid innocuous euphemisms?"
#2 2012-05-03 06:49:48
- Liam Mac
- Ivy Avenger
- From: Beyond!
- Posts: 4789
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
Great shoulder too! Interesting photo, HBH. Thanks.
"You've gotta get up close like this and - bada-BING! - you blow their brains all over your nice Ivy League suit."
suits/jackets 36/37S. waist 29-30. shirts 14.5/15 32.
#3 2012-05-03 09:18:08
- Hard Bop Hank
- Ivy Soul Brother
- From: land of a 1000 dances
- Posts: 4567
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
The waistcoats/ vests with lapels/ collars were also quite popular back then.
Didn't JS also have similar vests for his three-piece Tweed and Flannel suits winter 2010/11?
“No Room For Squares”
”All political art is bad – all good art is political.”
"Would there be any freedom of press or speech if one must reduce his vocabulary to vapid innocuous euphemisms?"
#5 2012-05-03 14:03:30
- Leer R.
- Member
- From: Vienna
- Posts: 1151
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
He was the grandfather of Mike Nichols... Interesting.
http://maennergarderobe.tk
Always interested in BB Makers shirts: 15.5/33, NOS unworn burgundy Beefrolls (like Florsheim Imperials): US 9- 9.5 (Weejuns are best in 9.5); apart from that: odd sack jackets or BB #1 suits: 38R, 39/40S.
#6 2012-05-03 14:21:06
- One For Bop
- Mr. Ivy
- From: time to time.
- Posts: 1464
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
Mental....
''By hurling yourself into the abyss you discover its a feather bed.”
#7 2012-05-03 14:51:07
- Liam Mac
- Ivy Avenger
- From: Beyond!
- Posts: 4789
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
Leer R. wrote:
He was the grandfather of Mike Nichols... Interesting.
That is too spooky.
"You've gotta get up close like this and - bada-BING! - you blow their brains all over your nice Ivy League suit."
suits/jackets 36/37S. waist 29-30. shirts 14.5/15 32.
#8 2012-05-03 15:00:49
- One For Bop
- Mr. Ivy
- From: time to time.
- Posts: 1464
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
nur nur nuuur nur, nur nur nuuur nur
''By hurling yourself into the abyss you discover its a feather bed.”
#9 2012-05-04 04:18:38
- Hard Bop Hank
- Ivy Soul Brother
- From: land of a 1000 dances
- Posts: 4567
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
Apart from his involvement in the first Munich rebublic (which only lasted a week) together with Kurt Eisner, Ernst Toller, Erich Mühsam and Ret Marut (who is probably also B.Traven, author of Treasure of Sierra Madre, Death Ship) he is most famously known here as a translator of Shakespeare, Oscar Wilde (Dorian Grey and Soul of Man).
His own writings are not that popular. Wikipedia mentions some of the essays, such as "Skepsis und Mystik" and "Die Revolution" and his journalist works as the editor of "Der Sozialist". His novel "Der Todesprediger" ("The preacher of death") was not even translated to English and is incredibly hard to find.
Anyway, I reckon suits like these were dead common. I just noticed this feature when someone send me the picture....
“No Room For Squares”
”All political art is bad – all good art is political.”
"Would there be any freedom of press or speech if one must reduce his vocabulary to vapid innocuous euphemisms?"
#10 2012-05-04 04:45:18
- Axelist
- Talker of the talk, walker of the walk.
- From: age
- Posts: 792
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
I find this interesting and odd. I doubt that this sort of roll was a fashion at that time. Actually, I can't remember to have seen a 3/2 roll before I learned about ivy.
Margarethe Leuschner, his first wife, is referred to have been a seamstress/tailor. He married her in 1892, the same year the photo was taken. Maybe she made the suit for him.
Just to get a repp..
#12 2012-05-04 05:53:02
- Axelist
- Talker of the talk, walker of the walk.
- From: age
- Posts: 792
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
E.U.R. wrote:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/e … ähr_01.jpg
Gustav Mahler 1907
Damn. Maybe this a "Gustav-Thing"? 
Just to get a repp..
#13 2012-05-05 16:47:50
- runic
- Member
- Posts: 43
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
For reference, here's a Brooks Brothers four button linen jacket from 1874: http://www.ebay.com/itm/150644566558
I would be tempted to roll that lapel into a 4/3...
Last edited by runic (2012-05-05 16:49:40)
#14 2012-05-05 21:20:27
- Typhoid_Jones
- Vintage American Clothier
- From: Boston, Massachusetts
- Posts: 191
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
^^^ Wow! I checked out the seller's finished auctions and was amazed. This guy deals in VINTAGE clothing, lol.
Quality Pre-Owned Clothing & Accessories on eBay.com:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/typhoid_jones/m … ksid=p3686
TYPHOID JONES: A Vintage American Clothier on Etsy.com:
http://www.etsy.com/shop/TyphoidJones
#15 2012-05-08 07:05:14
- Hard Bop Hank
- Ivy Soul Brother
- From: land of a 1000 dances
- Posts: 4567
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
Liam Mac wrote:
Leer R. wrote:
He was the grandfather of Mike Nichols... Interesting.
That is too spooky.
It was certainly merely a coincidence...
I'd seen the picture the other day, and I'd seen Kingstonian's thread on the 3/2 roll at Bookster, and then I posted the pic...
I still think it must have been quite popular.
I'm pretty sure the four button Brooks linen would have been worn with the top button rolled under the lapels and I reckon that we could find some more pics like these, maybe even going back to the 1840s...
“No Room For Squares”
”All political art is bad – all good art is political.”
"Would there be any freedom of press or speech if one must reduce his vocabulary to vapid innocuous euphemisms?"
#16 2012-05-08 11:04:28
- ThatGuy
- Ivy in St. Louis
- From: St. Louis
- Posts: 127
Re: Earliest picture of a 3/2 roll
I wonder if the buyer will be wearing that vintage BB jacket?