Film Noir Buff Style Forum / Hold It Right There: The Cravat

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-03 15:31:09

I read, only a few minutes ago, that Sir John Lally of the Ivy Shop, Richmond, occasionally sported one. I haven't done so since I was about ten or eleven and have never, as a mature, responsible adult, ever imagined doing so. Nor as an immature, irresponsible adult. I feel the same way about bow ties. Does anyone hold any strong opinions, one way or the other? Can they, under certain circumstances, be made to work? If so, how?

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-03 15:36:02

Picture me in 1970, taken out of Tuf shoes and snake belts and shoved - by an unfeeling mother - into orange shirt, paisley cravat, purple flares and plastic-looking Chelsea boots. Kicking a football around the playground was well-nigh impossible.

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-03 15:53:30

BTW, did it form part of the 'French Look'? Someone like Uncle Ian would know.

Yuca · 2021-12-03 18:31:22

Cravat: highly unlikely for me but they can actually look good. Bow tie? Only looks good with evening dress in my opinion. I never will share the IS infatuation with bow ties. They usually make the wearer look like a waiter. Or at best i.e. with a very good outfit, an elderly professor.

Jdemy · 2021-12-03 19:03:39

They always seem ridiculous to me- like a 1970’s wine connoisseur.

RobbieB · 2021-12-04 02:55:57

I've recently had a cold so took to wearing my maroon paisley Tootal silk scarf around my neck and tucked in. Several people commented saying are you wearing a cravat? I offered to remove the offending article but all have said no it looks cool!

Spendthrift · 2021-12-04 05:00:53

I remember once hitting the town wearing a new polkadot tootal. Feeling very pleased with myself until the barman looked up and said ‘what can I get you squadron leader?’. Still love it but rarely worn now

Last edited by Spendthrift (2021-12-04 13:28:16)

woofboxer · 2021-12-04 05:10:46

That’s funny Spendthrift!
Mrs W bought me one, so I was obliged to wear it once and its quietly tucked away in the drawer now. I’ve seen pictures of Miles Davis wearing them and he looked okay, but I’m inclined to think you have to be very cool to start with in order to look cool in a cravat.

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-04 05:16:34

You'll see shots of Marty Feldman wearing one. Miles, like Evans and Mulligan, didn't always look cool. He just looked fashionable. Well, they very often did, didn't they? But who was the first? Who was the trend-setter? For Sir John, of course, it may have been just a passing fancy.
But Mrs. Woof evidently meant well.

Patrick · 2021-12-04 07:03:33

No no no no no.

I saw a photo of an elderly Fred Astaire in a cravat, and he looked pretty good.

But he was Fred Astaire. I'm not.

Several years back I first observed a local ...hmm...wanker...yes he's more than a prat...anyway he was being the MC at a sort of end-of-summer party with a small jazzish group and this guy was wearing pleated chino shorts, a dress shirt and a cravat. And sandals. And I suppose he was trying to impress the elderly black lady singer or something, because the wanker's MC patter sounded like it came out of a book, "101 Cool Things to Say at Beatnik Parties" (Snodgrass & Slingsby, 1959).

The wanker has repeated this a couple times since, causing the following equation to become firmly embedded in my mind:

Cravat=wanker.

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-04 07:08:45

^ Lovely. Just read this out loud to my wife. Classic stuff. 'Talk Ivy' rocks!

woofboxer · 2021-12-04 08:04:26

What a merchant (banker).

A Fine Sadness · 2021-12-04 08:20:59

Remember the 80s here, Woof? A LOMBARD. Lots Of Money But A Right Dickhead. I did like that one, coming on top of YUPPIE, YAP and DINKY.

AFS · 2022-07-12 02:44:18

Sir John Lally wore not only a Paisley tie (silk?) but a cravat. TRS witnessed this. I express absolute - and I mean absolute - admiration of John Lally in this respect: selecting carefully his look and deploying it with great skill.

Kingston1an · 2022-07-12 03:00:56

Kenneth More and his crinkly hair and cravat.

Late 50s British cinema look. Leslie Phillips too - ding dong!

Dated.

AFS · 2022-07-12 03:24:02

Dated perhaps, yet not without a certain amount of class, wouldn't you say? Add Jack Hawkins to the list.

Runninggeez · 2022-07-12 04:27:23

Kenneth More & John Gregson in the film Genevieve perhaps.

AFS · 2022-07-12 05:13:47

Oh yes. And the beautiful, tragic Kay Kendall playing trumpet.

Tworussellstreet · 2022-07-12 08:02:51

I couldn't do it, but I admire those who do, even if they do look a bit daft. In the famous 1967 Ivy Shop staff outing photograph I recall one of the chaps in an Ivy blazer (a proper one, navy with brass buttons and patch and flap everything), button-down and a paisley cravat. Lally (he was often just called 'Lally') is also in a blazer with a scarlet red button-down, white jeans, heavy black horn-rim specs a la Michael Caine, and a sombrero. John Simons is dressed simply in a blue OCBD and a red cardigan. But it's a long time since I saw the pic so my memory may be foggy. The sombrero is definitely there. Pete Moss is there, and Paddy, the chap who drove like a lunatic and died in a car crash the following year. I recall lots of crew neck sweaters in the picture.

AFS · 2022-07-12 08:14:48

Did Pete Moss also die young?

Runninggeez · 2022-07-12 09:55:59

We had that same Ivy Shop outing photo in Harrington. I was told by Ian of Harrington it was taken at Butlins.

#1 2021-12-03 15:31:09

Hold It Right There: The Cravat

#2 2021-12-03 15:36:02

Re: Hold It Right There: The Cravat

#3 2021-12-03 15:53:30

Re: Hold It Right There: The Cravat

#4 2021-12-03 18:31:22

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#5 2021-12-03 19:03:39

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#6 2021-12-04 02:55:57

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#7 2021-12-04 05:00:53

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#8 2021-12-04 05:10:46

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#9 2021-12-04 05:16:34

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#10 2021-12-04 07:03:33

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#11 2021-12-04 07:08:45

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#12 2021-12-04 08:04:26

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#13 2021-12-04 08:20:59

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#14 2022-07-12 02:44:18

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#15 2022-07-12 03:00:56

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#17 2022-07-12 04:27:23

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#18 2022-07-12 05:13:47

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#19 2022-07-12 08:02:51

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#20 2022-07-12 08:14:48

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#21 2022-07-12 09:55:59

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