I find Yale an effective counterpoint (if that's the word I'm looking for) to Isaac. I find 'Manhattan' a disturbing movie, but have a framed still of Woody and Diane in silhouette on my study wall. 'Radio Days' I adore. 'Small Time Crooks' is probably underrated, but Elaine May makes it a corker IMO.
'Manhattan' certainly has an edge to it, in a way that, say, 'Annie Hall' doesn't. A pity Woody talks such rubbish on the American political scene: something by his own admission he's never taken much interest in, as a 'meat and potatoes' Democrat.
Does he talk rubbish about politics? I've always viewed him as largely apolitical, and a meat and pots Democrat can't be that bad a thing can it? I mean, I guess I'm a meat and pots Labour voter?
I increasingly value cinema more for it's purely cinematic qualities - ie. lighting, music, costume, the mise-en-scene, the quality of the artifice - and care less for plot, which is why I adore Manhattan. You're a lovely chap by the way and I thank you for contibution to my groaning library, which I received this morning.
g.g.
I hoped you didn't already own a copy... I knew it was a favourite of yours from a, I think, Toffeeman posting...
He said Obama should be granted dictatorial powers. He is otherwise, I think, still more or less apolitical.
I couldn't agree more about your attitude toward cinema - possibly shaped by watching Godard and Antonioni etc.? I watch stuff like Bond now only for the graphics. You were right about Herrman and Saul Bass BTW.
I like almost everything he made, haven't seen "whatever works" yet, but I'll be careful...
I really liked Vicky, Cristina, Barcelona, too, that was the last one I've seen... I'm not so happy about some of the very early stuff... Casino Royale is... funny, okay, but not something you would want to watch twice....
'Love And Death' happens to be my dear wife's favourite, although I suspect she is unaware of the literary and visual references.
I hope people - including GG himself - will forgive me for bumping this thread, but my mind is still often on Woody - and the more so as my wife and I sat through the awful 'Godfather 111' last night. Diane Keaton reprising her role as Kay.
I find it hard to go back to the old movies, especially 'Annie Hall' and 'Manhattan'. 'Radio Days', too, remains a favourite.
The original posting, however, which can be read by clicking on 'quote' - and should be - is important because it steered forum members back in the direction of a kind of 'fantasy' NYC (also to be seen in dozens of movies through the years, including 'Rosemary's Baby'). GGs attention to detail has always been second to none.
I did attempt the look around a dozen or so years ago with the natural shoulder tweed jackets and hefty shoes then moved on. But it's a look some of our posters may yet care to consider.
Just re-read my original post. It's not bad is it? I can write! Nice to read that. I agree with all that he says. In fact I mentioned Yale in a recent post on Instagram. It's an NYC I've never seen, as Blow Up is a London I've never seen. But they both make me love these places all the more.
Years ago, when we were contemplating the possibility of visiting the USA, my wife raised doubts about whether I would get much out of it. 'You'd need to go back in time' was what she said, and how right she was. The question is: how far back? The answer (perhaps) to when something like 85 per cent of clothing sales for men were 'Ivy League' (or whatever you choose to call it). Circa 1964? Earlier? To around the time Woody was telling funny jokes about orgasmic insurance to hip, sophisticated audiences? Then, for me anyway, if not necessarily our Gibson, there is the 'American Graffiti' period, so appreciated by Kenny Lovegrove and some of our current posters. All fantasy. All in the past. As Gibson said in another context, all dust.
I've just been looking over another old thread. Even I, with my limited intelligence, realised there were just too many blanks for it to be worth bumping. It concerns a writer called Norman Longmate. He wrote about the Americans in Britain during World War Two. Quite a few gloves came off and knuckles were bruised. Sammy was in there, stoutly defending me against JFM.
Time moves on, however, and my view of the United States is much altered - but as a complete outsider, not even a visitor. So the 'fantasy'/'Manhattan'/'Barefoot In The Park'/jazz in the Village aspect of it becomes all the more significant. Or at least I believe that to be the case. And wasn't it 'hip jazz visions' that JS was attempting to sell all those years ago? 'The wealthy customer'; the 'Esquire' reader; the guy who had his hair styled like JFK; the devotee of Miles, Chet, what might be happening Off-Broadway; the wearer of corduroy and horn-rimmed glasses. No? None of this? It's what it remains for me.
I'd quite forgotten the name of the actor: Michael Murphy. My word, though, that jacket he's wearing on his Wiki page looks as if it's taking the strain.
Some nice photographs of Murphy looking very Ivy indeed for sale on Ebay.
Linked to the original posting, albeit slightly tenuously, might be the slightly 'Bohemian' 1960s look in NYC: creative types in corduroy jackets: authors, artists, graphic designers, photographers - and jazz musicians natch. A world most of us on here were far too young and geographically removed to know but which some might attempt to recreate. The cinnamon cord jacket, chinos, maybe sneakers as an alternative to loafers. Depends where you're going and who you're meeting. Dress to impress some business contact or a beatnik chick? The choice is yours.
I keep returning to those corduroy jackets on the JS website. A 'Geography Teacher' look? I don't think so. Cinnamon, maybe dark Levis, sockless, the sneakers well-worn. You know 'On The Road' and 'Howl' by heart, Chet Baker is playing at that club around the corner and there's a hip new Jewish stand-up everyone is talking about. Oh, yes, and there's a party beginning at midnight. Latin jazz. Bring your own wine and charge.
I find this NYC-cool-UK vibe increasingly seductive. It can be done, of course, in a number of ways: according to the season. My word, though, it's subtle, completely 'under the radar', and pretty much eschewing any lingering notions of 'Ango-Ivy'. Quite looking forward now to wearing my sand-coloured duffle coat and striped scarf, rumpled chinos, button-down, conservative knitwear, possibly desert boots. 'Yale' might return next spring. Fabric? Tweed. Width of lapels? Undecided. Plain-fronted cotton trousers. A decent loafer or PTBs? Grey or beige USA-made Russell Athletic for hanging round the fives court hoping for a glimpse of a Smith girl...
I managed to find a few studies of Michael Murphy on Ebay. You can 'zoom' on occasion. I've just watched the movie, alone, and had ample time to look at the clothing. Yale trumps Isaac, don't you think? Our Gibson, just like Isaac's worst orgasm, was bang on the money. Also one or two nice plaid jackets to be seen in background shots. But the shoes? Is Isaac wearing sneakers with his check shirt and tweed jacket when he goes running to attempt his reconciliation with Ms. Hemingway? I couldn't quite tell. What do we suppose Yale would have favoured?
Isn't Liverpool supposed to be the only city in England with some kind of affinity with NYC?
Oh, yes, and what strikes me as 'Manhattan' as a movie is just how 'adult' it is, unlike so much American cinema - particularly modern American cinema, with its car chases, cutsie-pie/obnoxious teenagers, blatant product placement and endless violence. But, watch 'The Thin Man' first and draw comparisons. American cinema began its slow decline with the coming of Abbott and Costello - and it's sometimes difficult to take the French seriously if you consider that they find Jerry Lewis funny. Modernists - go back to the period 1933-1938: art deco, skyscrapers, dancing girls (and boys), a cold Martini, everything larger than life for the hard-hit Depression audience.
Manhattan is beautiful on so many levels.
I also recommend Manhattan Murder Mystery for the glimpses of the City.The film isn’t as cult as Manhattan but is still worth watching.
My first visit to New York many years ago was in the Winter and it got dark by mid afternoon.I was travelling all over buying records There was a slight uneasiness about being in the wrong part of the City on your own, Central Park was a no go zone and Times Square was dirty and full of people on the make. It was a far cry from Woody’s romantic vision.
Those times are largely over. There are no bad parts of the city, except maybe in the Bronx. Everything is gentrification and real estate.
I actually had a holiday booked in 2012. A week at the Roosevelt, followed by a week on Cape Cod. £5.000 and I missed out because I was deeply in love with another woman and couldn't bear to be parted from her. My wife and younger daughter went without me. So it goes. Besides, I hate airports and flying.
Like Mr.Singer, my late father was a dedicated record-buyer: cut-outs from - Tower? He really liked NYC. His first visit was in 1979 or 1980. Was it still pretty bad then?
The clothing aside, marvel at the photography and editing and wallow in that great Gershwin music. 'Strike Up The Band', which I think I'm fairly sure I've heard sung by Judy Garland, is very stirring if you know its earlier context as a patriotic song for World War Two (as heard in 'The World At War', which some of you will remember: that great Carl Davis score). Then there's 'Someone Who'll Watch Over Me', one of the greatest songs ever written. That era has so much excellent music to enjoy and the cross-pollination between Tin Pan Alley and jazz, classical and Porter/Porter-inspired charm and sophistication is simply marvellous, compelling.
This is a great thread to revisit, particularly after pondering The Look anew in the light of viewing some truly nasty clothing online - clothing that is not simply 'distressed' (code for worn-out, more or less) but actually dirty. Dirt seems to command more money (well, potential if not actual). So I'm turning back to Made In The USA Ralph Lauren and Scottish Paul Stuart. Brooks and Press where possible.
As to Yale himself, finding decent studies remains difficult, but there's still one of him on Ebay, wearing (I think) a polo shirt with his jacket (tweed?). Catch Yale wearing shagged-out Carhartt. I scarcely think so.