Again, I think we're all talking about two different things here:

- A proscriptive, strictly constructed trad that derives from historical, empirically observed modes of dress and that strives to conserve itself; this is trad according to Harris (and arguably Mr. Street). It remains linked to the particular milieu in which it originated, it relies on unbreakable orthodoxies, and it cannot be altered without being destroyed. In this sense "modern trad" is nonsensical; the style is set and cannot change.

- The descriptive, loosely constructed trad of the trad forum. This style of dress began with Harris' strict rules but over time it relaxed and focused more on a general theme than a rigid set of precepts. Now it describes something rather different than Harris' trad. This is trad understood as "whatever the people in the trad forum are wearing, to the extent that they themselves believe it to be trad."

Since this new trad aesthetic is determined by its constituents it becomes pointless to criticize it for being inauthentic or debased; one might as well dismiss Christians as inauthentic Jews, or surrealists as bad representative painters. From the Harris perspective one must certainly consider the Ask Andy form of trad a debased travesty, but that perspective doesn't really matter to the current trads (it may matter to others). So both sides make a legitimate claim: Cards explains that trad has changed and broadened (which it has, from the perspective of the current trad forum) and Russell claims that trad has fallen from grace and that it is the fruit of a deluded and inauthentic branch to begin with (which it is, from Russell's perspective). There really is no argument here - both sides are elaborating their own symbolic sartorial order, and although comparing their viewpoints may be amusing or even revelatory neither one can be declared right in a universal context.

So that said, what about the non-troll lifestyle trads, like Pink and Green and Old School Prep? These guys clearly think that trad is a lifestyle, not a set of clothing choices.

(I'm saving Mr. Cardinal for tonight so I can do him justice, btw)

Good stuff, Gil, if I'd a keener headpiece I'd put it like that.

Mr. Street, looking forward to it.  In the end, can't we all just love a natural shoulder jacket?

Only Mr. Cardinal can answer this.

Oh,  Trad... !

Last edited by Cardinals5 (2011-06-09 13:41:49)