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#1 2022-03-14 13:42:32

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

'Fratty'

A word I'd never come across before reading a late Elmore Leonard novel over the weekend.  Nick, something of a low-grade wiseguy, is described in this way.  He wears a UCLA (is that right?) sweatshirt and white Reeboks.  Is 'fratty' a spin-off (as it were) from 'preppie'/'preppy'?  Does it bear any relationship at all to 'Ivy League'?  Good old Elmore Leonard.  There'll never be another quite like him.

 

#2 2022-03-15 08:37:05

katon
Member
Posts: 363

Re: 'Fratty'

An Ivy-cousin -- think "Animal House". smile For various historical reasons, fraternity culture became more associated with state schools than the Ivy League, although that wasn't always the case.

 

#3 2022-03-15 11:10:40

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

It's certainly a look to be seen in England (and probably elsewhere in Europe).  In fact, it's fairly ubiquitous during the summer months amongst the 'student population' - perhaps having given rise to the Jack Wills look (a name now in every other charity shop).

 

#4 2022-03-15 13:57:22

Kingston1an
Member
Posts: 4180

Re: 'Fratty'

Good old Elmore Leonard indeed. I prefer his earlier works, maybe because the style was new to me. He had help from researchers. Otherwise how does an old bloke keep abreast of trends among younger folk.

Michael Connelly is very good - detective Hieronymous Bosch, based in Los Angeles. First got into him by mistake. I was actually looking for John Connolly - characters based in Maine and crime combined with unearthly forces. I heard a piece on the radio and picked a different crime writer with a similar surname. Both are very good. Caveat - the detectives always seem to be driven types who put in more hours on a case than most.


"Florid, smug, middle-aged golf club bore in this country I'd say. Propping up the 19th hole in deepest Surrey bemoaning the perils of immigration."

 

#5 2022-03-15 14:13:33

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

He wrote westerns beforehand, a genre much enjoyed by myself at one time: especially Louis L'Amour.  Sophisticates tend to despise westerns on the printed page whilst lauding the efforts of the overrated John Ford on the big screen.  But I've always enjoyed 'low' culture: pulp fiction for want of a better phrase, and once amassed a decent collection of pre-Campbell science fiction. 
Yes, the first half dozen novels are probably the best but 'Be Cool' kept me guessing until the end.
A gabby woman in Oxfam yesterday recommended Michael Connelly but I rarely consider recommendations from grabby women.
She asked me which 'jenner' I was interested in.

 

#6 2022-03-15 14:14:35

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

^ 'Gabby', goddammit.

 

#7 2022-03-15 14:18:20

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

I think, by the way, that Leonard was at least as good as Chandler, although Chandler at his best (see the opening paragraph of 'The Long Goodbye' for instance) was astounding: a good deal better than Hammett.

 

#8 2022-03-15 14:42:19

Kingston1an
Member
Posts: 4180

Re: 'Fratty'

I would like a detective who does the bare minimum, phones in sick a lot, has outside interests, looks forward to retirement.
McBain’s ‘Fat’ Ollie Weeks has good potential but others in the precincts always get the leading roles.


"Florid, smug, middle-aged golf club bore in this country I'd say. Propping up the 19th hole in deepest Surrey bemoaning the perils of immigration."

 

#9 2022-03-16 02:20:49

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

Ed McBain's early fiction (and, indeed, some of the later) is superb.  Which is that character with the streak of white in his hair?  I'd forgotten about 'Fat' Ollie till seeing a couple or three episodes of 'Hill Street Blues', when an allegedly corrupt detective put me in mind of him.  McBain - refreshingly - was obviously sympathetic to the problems of the average cop (if you can call the likes of Carella 'average').

 

#10 2022-03-16 02:22:02

AFS
Member
Posts: 2740

Re: 'Fratty'

Kingers, John Harvey's books, set on the mean streets of Nottingham, are worth a look.  AUS and Yuca may have stumbled on these.

 

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