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#26 2015-11-26 10:03:55

Acton_Baby
Member
From: West London
Posts: 3848

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

^ big_smile
To quote a friend of mine recently, describing a recent pub refurbishment nearby...
" it's all gone a bit heirloom tomato and lumberjack in there "

I admit it's a bit 'Brideshead Re-marketed' but Old Town do have some nice stuff in really good fabrics...
http://www.old-town.co.uk/collections/product


"I have about 100 pairs of pyjamas. I like to see people dressed comfortably."
Hugh Hefner

 

#27 2015-11-26 11:39:38

4F Hepcat
THE Cat
Posts: 14333

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Last edited by 4F Hepcat (2015-11-26 13:33:29)


Vibe-Rations in Spectra-Sonic-Sound

 

#28 2015-11-26 13:17:56

sonofstan
Member
Posts: 261

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

 

#29 2015-11-26 14:10:44

Sidewinder
Member
Posts: 610

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

 

#30 2015-11-26 14:56:29

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

It took me nearly 40 years of existence to discover ivy, then several more to work out how to do it in a way in which I am possibly content. So I suspect I'll be holding on to it indefinitely. Personally the workwear thing doesn't appeal, although heavy ivy/70s campus style is ok when I am unable or unwilling to dress up. The only other style I am really tempted by is what I see on those mid 50s to early 60s continental movies. If I had the money to go to an Italian or French tailor to get a late 50s style 3 button suit or jacket I would be tempted, but I'm sure even then I would mix it with vintage Brooks shirt and gunboats.

Still ivy is not for everyone. For all the faux ivy that is or has been on trend in recent years, the real deal is increasingly unfashionable, so I can understand people wanting to move with the times.

However I'm an aesthete, and as far as I'm concerned every time I wear an old Makers BD I become a walking art gallery, regardless of whether or not the rest of the population notices or shares the sentiment. For that reason I can't imagine myself letting go of the natural shoulder.


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#31 2015-11-26 15:46:37

Bop
Member
Posts: 7661

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

For me moving with the times is dressing like it's 1979. It's a big step and it's taken much consideration.

 

#32 2015-11-27 07:42:32

SpringForward
Member
Posts: 82

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

A maverick opinion perhaps, but I sometimes like the English Jermyn Street style shirt as an option to the button down with a natural shouldered jacket or suit.
It was worn back in the Ivy day in America sometimes.
Personal choice should override other people's rules of proscribed dress?

 

#33 2015-11-27 08:17:20

Bop
Member
Posts: 7661

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

I think the issue has always been..it's Talk Ivy...with a huge dollop of Americana and a wiff of the modernist...there is nothing wrong with other styles they all can be done well...but it doesnt mean they have to be discussed here when we have the wardrobe...which could do with an injection every now and again. I wouldnt go as far to say Im upset by it when people do or that i dont wear some things some purists would gawk at..but I appricate not diluting things to heavily when it comes to the theme of the forum

Last edited by Bop (2015-11-27 08:20:29)

 

#34 2015-11-27 08:27:01

woofboxer
Devil's Ivy Advocate
From: The Lost County of Middlesex
Posts: 7959

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Hard to say what a Jermyn Street style shirt is now. There are a multitude of collar types on offer down thereand several places do button downs, just not very good ones.


'I'm not that keen on the Average Look .......ever'. 
John Simons

Achievements: banned from the Ivy Style FB Group

 

#35 2015-11-27 11:12:48

stanshall
Member
From: Gilligan's Island
Posts: 12991

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?


"bow wow wow yippie yo yippie yay"

 

#36 2015-11-27 11:42:11

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#37 2015-11-27 23:46:52

4F Hepcat
THE Cat
Posts: 14333

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

I've actually gone the Fred Astaire cuffed flannels route for this winter - all that's missing are some brown suede shoes which perfected his look. To get the right level of space in the pants around the crotch and drape, I had to go to a 56 and get them seriously taken in. Everything around at the moment is ball crushing!

Some of his wardrobe in the Chrysler sponsored Fred Astaire shows from the late 50s are spot on.

He more than anyone perfected that mid-Atlantic look, half-American and English. More so than Cary Grant.

I do feel in these challenging times a debonnaire mission of urbane nonchalance is the perfect two fingers salute of defiance.


Vibe-Rations in Spectra-Sonic-Sound

 

#38 2015-11-28 02:51:37

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Astaire was more like ivy with an English twist imo. I sure as hell haven't seen any Brits in the 50s looking like that, but aside from a few details he had a common US 50s look.


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#39 2015-11-28 08:42:55

4F Hepcat
THE Cat
Posts: 14333

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

^Of course, back then the US was technologically and culturally 10 years ahead of us, but Astaire seems to me the most English of American stars.


Vibe-Rations in Spectra-Sonic-Sound

 

#40 2015-11-28 08:49:18

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Well I don't think any Brits were looking like that in the 60s either. I agree though that he definitely had a uniquely English-influenced take on the look. He was also an expert at combining clothes (or maybe he just looked good in any combination of colours).


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#41 2015-11-28 08:53:03

4F Hepcat
THE Cat
Posts: 14333

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

And he could play the drums to the modern beat all 'reet.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulkCG2E-QNY


Vibe-Rations in Spectra-Sonic-Sound

 

#42 2015-11-28 09:00:59

Acton_Baby
Member
From: West London
Posts: 3848

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Mr Astaire favoured Anderson and Shepard for his tailoring.
G. Bruce Boyer's book 'Fred Astaire Style' is a good read, although interestingly he tries to connect his style with the pre-war US collegiate style ( and fails IMHO, Fred's look is too eclectic to pin down to one influence).


"I have about 100 pairs of pyjamas. I like to see people dressed comfortably."
Hugh Hefner

 

#43 2015-11-29 03:03:50

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

I've not read the book but the theory as you describe it makes perfect sense. Brown shoes; no break cuffed flannels; brown tweed jacket; Brooks BD; repp or foulard or bow tie; an English influence to the tailoring - sounds very similar to prewar campus style to me.

He did wear other outfits sometimes e.g. double breasted navy suits, but the above seemed to be his default style.


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#44 2015-11-29 03:43:38

Acton_Baby
Member
From: West London
Posts: 3848

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?


"I have about 100 pairs of pyjamas. I like to see people dressed comfortably."
Hugh Hefner

 

#45 2015-11-29 05:51:14

Yuca
Member
Posts: 8543

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

If so then those dancers/entertainers in the post 1918 period must have been very similar to classic ivy (minus the 60s more casual developments). Do you have any evidence for this?

N.B. my FA info is mostly based on his 50s films.


some sort of banal legitimacy

 

#46 2015-11-29 08:13:47

Acton_Baby
Member
From: West London
Posts: 3848

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

Most of my evidence is in the book,
Constance Valis Hill - Tap Dancing America: A Cultural History

I was researching a 'one-legged' tap-dancer Clayton 'peg-leg' Bates and came across the 'neck tie as belt' gimmick , which FA 'borrowed' later.
Further digging has pictures of dancers ( both black and white ) in what is pretty much the FA look in the early '20's it seems the deeply pleated 'no break' flannels gave great freedom and accentuated the leg and foot movements of the dancers on stage.
The 'nipped in' shorter jacket I've assumed was for much the same reason.

Another book worth looking at is
Jim Siegelman - The Book of Tap: Recovering America's Long Lost Dance
Gives an interesting overview of the change in performers attire ( mainly covers what the author describes as the 'post Gene Kelly years but also has some great info on the early C20 but few pictures).


"I have about 100 pairs of pyjamas. I like to see people dressed comfortably."
Hugh Hefner

 

#47 2015-11-29 08:39:31

4F Hepcat
THE Cat
Posts: 14333

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

The Boyer book on FA I've been meaning to get around to for sometime, but not quite purchased it yet.

This is quite good too on Astaire's jazz credentials:

http://www.ucpress.edu/book.php?isbn=9780520268906


Vibe-Rations in Spectra-Sonic-Sound

 

#48 2015-11-29 11:01:07

Worried Man
Member
From: Davebrubeckistan
Posts: 15988

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?


"We close our sto' at a reasonable hour because we figure anybody who would want one of our suits has got time to stroll over here in the daytime." - VP of George Muse Clothing, Atlanta, 1955

 

#49 2015-11-30 06:55:33

SpringForward
Member
Posts: 82

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

 

#50 2015-11-30 07:05:09

SpringForward
Member
Posts: 82

Re: Is There An Ivy Afterlife?

 

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