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#1 2006-07-01 06:08:28

Miles Away
Member
From: Miles away
Posts: 1180

AHAT: WTF?

Anybody can put on what is called 'Trad' (or CAD) in the U.K. and be bestowed with instant cool. It's very hard for that not to happen over here. Same in France, Italy, Germany, Spain. (If I'm wrong Daniele, slap me down - It's fine.)

Over in the U.S. (Who, let me be clear, OWN this style) anybody can put on' Trad'/CAD and be met with some very mixed reactions indeed it would seem (... I've read about all this on other internet forums).

Turn it all around -
Americans wearing Savile Row = No problem. Honestly. If anything, an Englishman will like you more if you wear it.
... So what about an Englishman wearing Savile Row? Honestly I think the 'Class' thing has gone - All you will look is clothes-savvy & rich (And being rich is nothing to do with 'Class' in the old sense now over here, if anything the real upper class are often broke & look like tramps in my experience.)

So why is U.S. 'Trad'  playing with the whole taboo frisson of Class status symbols? And doing it in 2003- 2006?
WTF?
And WHY?
This is cultural and very little to do with the clothes for the hardcore who wear the clothes as a badge of faith.
Help me understand?
I say it is 'Reactionary Chic' transplanted from the U.K. 20 years on into the U.S. and adopting U.S. styles of dress & calling them 'Traditional' as if they were a Scotsman's Kilt.
What is going on in America to produce the current 'Trad' movement on the internet? Are we seeing nervous people clinging to imagined old certainties?
- Not in every case, but just the vociferous hysterical minority? (sp? I'm sure).
Let me tell you that the genuine European Upper Classes do not behave in this way & that you look damn odd out in the big wide world if you think that by being a snob you look 'posh'. The reverse is true. Snobbery always looks Lower-Middle class at best.
So why are people playing 'Blue-Blood' in this day & age?
What's going on? (That was Marvin just then, that was.)
Miles


" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.

 

#2 2006-07-05 04:39:00

Horace
Member
Posts: 6433

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Last edited by Horace (2006-07-05 04:40:36)


""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.

 

#3 2006-07-05 05:15:01

Miles Away
Member
From: Miles away
Posts: 1180

Re: AHAT: WTF?

I think that has to be the way forward.
Thank you for your consideration.
Miles.


" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.

 

#4 2006-07-07 05:09:05

Horace
Member
Posts: 6433

Re: AHAT: WTF?


""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.

 

#5 2006-07-07 06:13:04

Miles Away
Member
From: Miles away
Posts: 1180

Re: AHAT: WTF?

This is all very interesting. Especially the Fraudian analysis. (sp?)
Thanks -


" ... Ubi bene, ibi patria, which being roughly translated means, 'Wherever there's a handout, that's for me, man.' "
Alistair Cooke. 1968.

 

#6 2006-07-07 15:58:37

Tyto
Member
Posts: 103

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Last edited by Tyto (2006-07-07 16:00:07)

 

#7 2006-07-08 05:14:49

Horace
Member
Posts: 6433

Re: AHAT: WTF?


""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.

 

#8 2007-02-20 05:21:54

Terry Lean
Member
Posts: 2440

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Bump, now AHAT is back.

I've got the coffin lid & I've got the nails...

Can't we lay this nonsense to rest?

'Internet fun' has a short shelf life. It's the nature of the medium. It's why good people drift away.
Yeah you've duped the dopes. That you did back in 2005, tops.
Keep it going this long & who's the dope now?
All I've got to offer on this topic is frustration.
You're better than this, people...
Move on maybe?

t.


"One of these mornings
You're going to rise up singing"

 

#9 2007-02-20 05:33:20

Horace
Member
Posts: 6433

Re: AHAT: WTF?


""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.

 

#10 2007-02-20 05:36:45

Terry Lean
Member
Posts: 2440

Re: AHAT: WTF?

The computer, she is a bad dressed bitch.


"One of these mornings
You're going to rise up singing"

 

#11 2007-02-20 10:09:05

Tyto
Member
Posts: 103

Re: AHAT: WTF?

 

#12 2007-02-20 10:59:11

Terry Lean
Member
Posts: 2440

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Not at all. I should apologise to you.

I used AHAT to bump this only because I wanted to.
Any excuse will do for me!

I'm keen that we all do 'Trad' right this time round so I'm more than a little trigger happy - Ask any of my PM chums!

I WANT the class association in Trad presented by a genuine AmTrad & not a troll or a parody over here. And I'm hoping we've now found one who can do just that.
I want EVERY aspect of this style in the mix.
I've just got no more patience for all the old stuff that's been talked about on this style that's given it the name it has on the MBs to date.

So... Yeah... My troll-detector is set on high at the moment, but it's nothing to do with you...
It's just that I'm imagining I can see a way forward for Ivy style at last and that's too good a thing for me to allow a re-run of AAAT over here in the hallowed halls of FNB.

Why I imagine I'm in charge of the good name of Ivy is beyond me!

So you & I are cool, don't worry.
And I'm cool with anyone else who's cool too...

But I will not allow sainted popovering to spoil things again!

*Froth*Rant*Froth*

...Time for a drink I think...

t.  wink


"One of these mornings
You're going to rise up singing"

 

#13 2007-02-20 12:26:22

Coolidge
Member
Posts: 1192

Re: AHAT: WTF?

 

#14 2007-02-20 12:31:49

Terry Lean
Member
Posts: 2440

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Indeed.
Brother Tyto is fine.
Anybody wandering into the world of "Ivy Vs Trad" as constructed by me is bound to wonder what the hell is going on.
I sometimes wonder myself why I do it...
.. But not for too long (short attention span you see).

t.


"One of these mornings
You're going to rise up singing"

 

#15 2007-02-20 16:07:12

Tyto
Member
Posts: 103

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Coolidge (and Terry):

Thanks for the kind words, but I had actually meant to apologize for (I thought) stirring up the trad/class wasps' nest, rather than for not being a northeasterner. I threw in the background stuff merely to illustrate how I learned about TNSIL and why I hadn't associated it exclusively with the Ivy League. And, like you, I'm not in the habit of apologizing for who/what I am.

Best,

---Tyto

 

#16 2007-02-20 16:33:16

Lord Hillyer
Member
Posts: 507

Re: AHAT: WTF?

Fascinating.

 

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