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#76 2007-01-31 01:59:28

Terry Lean
Member
Posts: 2440

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

Not that my corroboration is needed, but I'd agree with FNB's observations on the English.
Very well observed.


"One of these mornings
You're going to rise up singing"

 

#77 2007-02-01 16:43:37

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#78 2007-02-02 17:12:28

jsprowls9
Member
From: Denver, CO
Posts: 250

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

Thank you for your help, Marc. I can't begin to tell you how much I appreciate the help.

Just to provide a little update:

I spoke with OWTextiles today about Acorn fabrics. The rep is really great; and, he will be sending swatch cards my way. This makes me very happy.

I also spoke to a jobber in Toronto who reps both suitings and shirtings. He can get me Thomas Mason, Palladini, and several others direct from the mill for much less than my previous supplier has been charging me. He also tells me that I can extend my suitings offering from Holland & Sherry & Dormeuil to include: Zegna, Reda, Barberis, Loro Piana, etc. I'll be visiting their booth at a Denver trade show this weekend, so I'm eager to find other sources.

I have to tell you folks that I was a little depressed, last month. The H&S and Dormeuil books arrived for 2007 with a markedly more expensive price tag (both for the book and the yardage). I can't justify the chasm to customers, so I'm actively seeking new suppliers. I foresee several trips to Montreal and Toronto in the near future.

I will attempt to contact Mr Montero to see if he will sell Riva to me. It's funny that Charvet was turned down; but, industry folks operate under different principles. It may be that Charvet's supply chain manager's personality simply didn't mesh with Mr Montero's. Or it could've been that Montero only likes to support smaller ventures. It's difficult to speculate.

 

#79 2007-02-02 17:45:24

Film Noir Buff
Dandy Nightmare
From: Devil's Island
Posts: 9345

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

 

#80 2007-02-02 19:24:24

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

JS, Look into Baberis and Carlo Barbera for suits and SIC Tess for shirts.  SIC Tess is close behind Riva but more obtainable because they are larger---Probably 15x larger than Riva.  Plus, most men have not heard of Riva and might not appreciate it anyway.  Testa is good, too.  I'll be seeing a swatch book from a new name in Italian shirtings in a few days (at least new for me) that is supposed to be golden and I'll let you know more.


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#81 2007-02-02 19:50:23

jsprowls9
Member
From: Denver, CO
Posts: 250

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

On this jobber's list are: E. Thomas (suitings), SIC Tess and Testa (shirtings). I'm pretty sure I'll be lost in just his booth most of the day, tomorrow. I'm eager to hear of these new shirtings, too, Marc. I'd rather hear from you folks what you'd like to see. I'm happy to track it down and see what makes sense to bring forward.

 

#82 2007-02-03 00:55:59

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#83 2007-02-03 09:13:11

jsprowls9
Member
From: Denver, CO
Posts: 250

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

 

#84 2007-02-03 12:15:37

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

The other thing about Riva and similarly sheer cottons is they will not not have universal appeal.  Many, maybe most, men (and their significant others) are accustomed to a more "substantial" look and feel to their shirts and would be put-off by steep prices of shirts that are not "perceived" to be worth those prices.  I was one such person who had been averse to supefine cottons, until I learned though personal experience of their durability and resistance to wrinkling, which is directly attributed to their high quality.


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#85 2007-04-05 10:52:58

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

A well-designed, well-made shirt strives to encompass 1) comfort, 2) proper fit/balance, 3) symmetry, 4) the way in which the shirt moves with the person wearing it, and 5) aesthetics, such as precise pattern matching (pattern-matching in *every* intersection of shirt components, such as yoke to shoulder).  It is impossible to achieve the most prioritized elements of numbers 1 thru 4 *and* precise pattern-matching in *every* part of *every* shirt.  Sometimes, yes, other times, no, depending on the client's own physical attributes.  Number 5 involves a balance with numbers 1 thru 4, which can involve some compromises in pattern-matching.

I cannot speak for other shirtmakers, but given his formal tailoring backround dating back to apprenticing at age 9 and later, in the 1970s, being recruited by British tailoring houses to teach pattern-making, my shirtmaker in Rome employs advanced tailoring techniques in the making of his shirts, such as achieving proper balance in all aspects of the shirt.  Armholes and shoulders are made slightly larger or smaller depending on the client's specifications, the goal being complete comfort.  Say, for example, the same striped cloth were used to make shirts for several different clients, each with different shoulder and armhole specs.  Given the stripes are the same with each shirt, but variances exist in the shoulder and armhole measurements, it would be impossible to achieve perfect pattern alignment from yoke to shoulder with each shirt.  Factoring in the complexity of achieving comfort, proper fit and balance, and a sort of 3-dimensional movement of the shirt with the client's body, aligning patterns between the yoke and shoulder cannot be assured and, in the end, is almost a triviality with a truly great shirtmaker.  Actually, I've seen $10 shirts at Costco where the stripes align, so it's shallow to use this as a standard of quality.  A masterfully made shirt combines such a myriad of elements that reducing it to the superficial criterion of matching patterns diminishes the art of shirtmaking.


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#86 2007-04-16 22:07:52

Patrick Bateman
Member
Posts: 1006

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

http://www.askandyaboutclothes.com/forum/showpost.php?p=536751&postcount=2


女性の鑑定家

 

#87 2007-04-17 00:47:03

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#88 2007-04-17 02:22:08

Twin Six
Member
From: WASP in Tokyo
Posts: 1486

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

 

#89 2008-05-16 17:53:52

Film Noir Buff
Dandy Nightmare
From: Devil's Island
Posts: 9345

Re: On the pattern matching of shirts

Bumped for renewed discussion

 

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