Film Noir Buff Style Forum / Can you tell occupation by apparel?

captainpreppy · 2013-04-13 18:43:34

In the thread about the forum dying someone mentioned people trying to guess his occupation by his apparel. It seems like an odd notion. Now I am not talking about a policeman or fireman in uniform, a mechanic or plumber in coveralls or anything like that.

What brought this to mind was an event last week. I was attending a social event for which the prescribed dress code was "business" attire. It occurred in a towering new office building on the periphery of downtown Los Angeles. To my surprise, it was standing on land that had been once owned by my great-great-grandfather, the adjacent street being named after him. (The land was sold by his heirs in 1902, so we never got any profit from it.) Anyway, to get back to the story, I was wearing a midnight blue two-piece suit, white French-cuff shirt, Brioni tie and black A-E PA's. I was one of only two men in attendance who was "rockin' the square." Anyway, I got to talking to a university professor and his wife. I mentioned that I had spent most of my career editing firearms magazines. They replied that I certainly "didn't look the part." That struck me as surprising. Conservative business dress has pretty narrow parameters, so how was I supposed to have dressed to look the part of a former gun writer/editor? I suppose I could have worn a plaid flannel shirt with a bolo tie, one of those "Western" jackets with the yoke, a big, garish rodeo buckle and cowboy boots, and topped off the whole thing with a big Stetson (worn indoors, of course). I might then have fulfilled their stereotypes, but I certainly would not have been in "business attire," and I would have looked like a boor and buffoon. The prof, I might mention, was not in business attire but "decent casual." (Seemed like a real nice guy, though.)

This is sort of a lengthy intro to the question how, if there is a prescribed dress code, be it "black tie," "business" or "cocktail" attire or even "dressy casual," can you possibly determine anything about a man's occupation? You may be able to make inferences from the clothing about the man's level of wealth, taste, social standing, that sort of thing, but even those are not likely to be too reliable. Some men who are very prosperous simply don't like to spend much on clothes; others, like most iGents and I, will spend above their means on clothing.

Anyway, anybody here have any thoughts on this?

Jeff Reed · 2013-04-13 19:16:48

I do not think it is very likely one will succeed in guessing. Maybe in the past. Not today.

I work in the financial district of New York. I can reliably point out the stockbrokers that work in bucket shops and that is about it. Shiny shirts, pointy shoes, fat knots, a working class accent (and the volume to go with it), poor posture standing (often leaning on objects) or walking (lots of upper body movement---to appear larger and scarier?). I suppose the analysis goes beyond clothes, but clothes are often enough. Also, it is relatively easy to determine if a woman is an executive or an admin, but as for nailing down anything more than that, I don't think I can do it.

At work I am free to dress as I choose. Most people think I am an academic. I am actually called "Professor Reed" by many acquaintances. I am not a professor or associated with academia as a profession. But no one is going to think I am a stockbroker either.

4F Hepcat · 2013-04-14 00:37:50

The relaxing of dress codes is probably universal and certainly evident in the the oil & gas industry: suits and ties are a raririty these days, and it is more difficult on visual inspection to distinguish between the document controller, the desk expeditor against the high flying line manager of a business unit or project director. Few are dressing the parts with the exception of the Group level lawyers and accountants. There are exceptions ofcourse, but these are not the norm.

In the company I first worked for, which was an engineering construction company, there was a definite dress code for those not at the shop floor grunt level: the accountants and the commercial disciplines wore pinstripe suits and contrast collars and flamboyant ties, the site and project managers would sport tweed jackets and plaids with conservative ties and brown shoes, the other professional disciplines would be M&S grey suits and ties, with black shoes. You could tell instantly the indvidual's discipline and approximate position and responsibilities in the organisation from appearance alone.

I sometimes travel on the train in the rush hour to the Hague, a town populated by oil & gas, NGO, non-proliferation treaty organisations, human rights lawyers, European Patent Office and other such organisations and it is impossible in most cases to make any assumption on profession or where someone works on their style of dress. Indeed, there seems to be a drab, chairman Mao shirt type uniformity across the sexes. I do my best to inject a bit of flair to the proceedings, but we seem to have arrived at the point of normlessness in professional dress codes, which is not necesssarily a good thing IMO.

But despite all of this, people still make assumptions on dress (obviously), but the less obvious trend is why so few make the effort with their style, when it remains a powerful leading signifier of who and what you are about.

Taylor McIntyre · 2013-04-14 00:44:31

I've always enjoyed the disconnect between my clothes, my various occupations and my personality. It's a fun game. To me it all connects and makes sense. To the outside world I enjoy the confusion I can sometimes provoke.

Currently I do some Menswear consultancy and delight in showing up in an old pair of jeans and an army jacket to talk in hair-splitting detail about 'Ivy League' tailoring for a couple of hours. 'What does a clothing obsessive look like ?' is the game I'm playing.

I was recently painted by a student friend for his degree show called 'Dandy' - It's me in just jeans & a T shirt with a glass of red & a ciggie surrounded by masses of clothes. All his other 'Dandy' portraits are all velvet and funny facial hair. Oh, and lots of flowers too.

Not that I'm a 'Dandy'.

4F Hepcat · 2013-04-14 01:20:02

But you are deliberately subverting expectations on purpose - for desired effect to unsettle and unnerve the audience, yes?

Taylor McIntyre · 2013-04-14 02:17:42

The joy is that I'm just pleasing myself. Then everybody else is lumbered with trying to make sense out of the senseless...

What 'Statement' am I making ? The last one they'd ever think of. I just wear clothes.

Chévere · 2013-04-14 05:52:29

Last edited by Chévere (2013-04-14 05:52:47)

Film Noir Buff · 2013-04-14 08:17:33

doghouse · 2013-04-14 09:07:02

Cat undertaker. That is fantastic.

Reckless Reggie · 2013-04-14 09:32:48

The world is far too caught up (especially I fear in the USA), with the desire to be acknowledged as 'special' and 'with status' - it is exactly this that breeds all the angst and rest-room mirror, shaky, cell-phone photographs and all the yards of drivel on the lesser fora boards.

formby · 2013-04-14 09:49:58

SartorialKil1a · 2013-04-15 15:34:28

I work at one of the 3 German "premium" car OEMs and to my delight, engineers/managers (all managers are engineers by degree) and accountants that want to go places are still pretty much in suit and tie. Bespoke or dashing details might only account for a low % of dress, but some sort of care is still taken.
Where there is no sense of dress at all is in the grunt field of IT and engineering, those doing the coding others have specified. Might as well keep their bed pyamas on.
What absolutely astonished me when I started work here was the way women dress. Engineers/Managers are pretty much 50/50 divided into looking like a cheap slut and looking like your grandmothers library clerk, while all the admin girls pretty much dress the same way they would on a saturday out, which is nice to the eye but somehow irks me wrong in the workplace. Might tell more about me than them, though...

captainpreppy · 2013-04-15 17:10:46

#1 2013-04-13 18:43:34

Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#2 2013-04-13 19:16:48

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#3 2013-04-14 00:37:50

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#4 2013-04-14 00:44:31

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#5 2013-04-14 01:20:02

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#6 2013-04-14 02:17:42

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#7 2013-04-14 05:52:29

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#8 2013-04-14 08:17:33

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#9 2013-04-14 09:07:02

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#10 2013-04-14 09:32:48

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#11 2013-04-14 09:49:58

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#12 2013-04-15 15:34:28

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

#13 2013-04-15 17:10:46

Re: Can you tell occupation by apparel?

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