Tim - as mentioned a couple of times on here I’m a Gitman fan, the oxfords are excellent quality, take a look at Cultizm in Germany, in the EU, priced in Euros, big savings if you see something you like in your size, shipping about 20 euros, I guess they’re going to get even more expensive soon with the weakness of the GBP & Euro against the USD, personally I’d buy a Gitman over JS every time,

Finding an ethically made, Ivy acceptable BD flannel shirt made in UK or USA for a sub-£100 will be ever more tricky. It is a tiny, declining customer base and high standard you seek.
The additional costs and postal surcharges will make any option much more expensive.
What about locally made options to where you live? Or dropping the need for BD collar. Then just in UK other options become possible.
As we are finding, ethics in clothing can be expensive. It is hard to know what to do sometimes,other than buy less (and therefore better) or second hand.
Ivy wear is fading away I believe, it is only going to become more niche and expensive so either your wallet or choice will have to give at some point.

Last edited by An Unseen Scene (2022-09-19 16:00:05)

Unseen Scene - ‘ Ivy wear is fading away I believe, it is only going to become more niche and expensive so either your wallet or choice will have to give at some point.’

Maybe in the short term yes, but having observed this for a few decades I’m confident that in due course there will be a resurgence of interest in the Ivy Look. In the early 70s when the glam-rock, hairy flarey style was king no one would have forseen that a few years later button down collars and loafers would be back. Traditional American and Italian looks have formed the bedrock of mens clothing styles for 70 years. Every time the designers run out of fresh ideas they reach for the Ivy look book, it’s never far away. There’s always now going to be a proportion of men who are happy living in jeans and football shirts or tracksuits and there’s always going to be men who want to make more effort, even if the effort is something we would see as being fairly minimal. But then we’re not normal are we?

Ivy as part of the wider fashion world still comes and goes. Problem is as part of fast fashion it comes and goes so quick you'd miss it unless you happened to chance across that days online promotion or piece on J Simons.

We all know Uniqlo's good for a few pieces. Last season's Next collection featured some logo-less shirts in decent colourways and fits with good collars, back pleats and locker loops (although even I never bit) Loafers, desert boots.. A few retailers had a go at copying Paraboot style shoes. Nothing earth shattering or worth a special trip but the ghost of ivy is often there. The high street has definitely now moved on from skin tight half mast trousers and one finger collars.

Of course a lot of guys into ivy league style clothing wouldn't have set foot in high street chain stores for years so would have missed this. And if you're used to what I think of as the 'Ivy big gun' names, it's true that the quality and ethics just isn't there.

I don't know if I'm fussed about another buzz around Ivy really. You've only got to look on Instagram to see that people who want to are finding and wearing the stuff and interpreting it in different ways.  I don't think it would add anything for me to walk down the road and see a hundred kids dressed in it.

I believe M&S played a fairly large part in hammering in Brooks final nails. Just a complete mis match. But people who know more than me would probably say the rot had set in well before then. I'll never get my head around the Italian ownership. I had it on very good authority that there were aircraft hanger sized warehouses full of Brooks just waiting to be distributed around Europe. Not long after it started popping up in TK Maxx and discount on line stores, which is a sure sign that something's gone tits up somewhere.

Ralph/Sperry etc are all jumping on the recycled bottle bandwagon. Doesn't really do any good as the the final product can't be re-recycled. So fast fashion+ethical talk still=landfill.

''Ralph/Sperry etc are all jumping on the recycled bottle bandwagon. Doesn't really do any good as the the final product can't be re-recycled. So fast fashion+ethical talk still=landfill.''

Better the plastic bottle turned into a shirt, than clogging up the oceans. That's the way I see it. It's a step in the right direction.

^Indeed, you wouldn't want to be wearing synthetic shirts everyday.