The denim button down; one of my favourite items at this time of year. A step up in ruggedness from the chambray equivalent, it needs to be in a lightweight denim with unobtrusive stitching and have just the right amount of collar roll. If either the stitching or cloth are too heavy then it’s time to get the Tammy Wynette CDs out.
I picked up a particularly tasty example by Kamakura a few years ago and always look forward to putting it on as autumn rolls in. It needs to be worn carefully, never with jeans as that would be double denim’ing, a cardinal sin and time to get the Bon Jovi CDs out. But it looks a treat with a tweed and especially with a cord jacket, it provides that crucial note of discord so essential to the perfect Ivy combination. It’s a shame to hide its magnificence under a sweater so I don’t, if the opportunity exists to wear a tie then a red knitted one is the finest accompaniment.
Anyone else partaking?
Yes. I am big on the denim buttondown, and have a rather stupidly large collection of them, along with their lighter brother, the chambray shirt. I arrived at the decision that blue denim and chambray are more interesting tonally than oxford cotton, so my Brooks shirts have been largely jettisoned in favour of denim. My teenage mod self would truly be ashamed of this development, as denim was always a bit on the greebo end of things, apart from the sacred 501s of course. And denim with cord - phwoaar, that is Ivy nirvana.
I did denim BD shirts in the 90s, living in Canada. Sometimes I made the mistake of doing double denim. OK for Toronto, great for Calgary Cowboy country but frowned upon in Vancouver.
I even had a Levi Jean jacket with a leather collar! Generally speaking I was usually kitted out in RL from the local store.
Denim shirts look great.
When worn with tweed or cord jackets they help remove any stuffy connotations.
I like a red tartan tie with a denim button down. Very Ralph
I don’t own a denim bd. But definitely have one on my ‘wants list’. Closest I have is a modern Gant chambray.
I contemplated a fairly nice high street one not long ago. A washed out light green number. Had nice details but of course the collar size let it down.
What I do like about them is they sit very firmly as American Ivy. Rather than crossing over into being accessible to other scenes/styles. As a lot of other button downs do.
Chambray: yes. Denim: if it works for you then don't let me stop your fun, but not for me as I don't want to spend all day singing Never Gonna Give You Up.
I don't care for denim outside jeans and I am less inclined to wear them now.
Paul Simons showed me the JS denim buttondown yesterday. Not sure they've quite got this one right - colour too dark and are those collars just a little too long, verging on Harry Hill territory..?
TRS 'and are those collars just a little too long', - In my humble opinion YES, I bought one of last years check wool b/d and whilst I like the cloth the collar is 1/4 inch too long, won't be buying anymore JS shirts, unless a) they shorten the collar length, b) improve the ropey buttons they use, I've only ever bought 3 JS shirts since CS opening in 2011, TBH I haven't been happy with any of them, and whilst we're on the subject of shirts @ CS , ( I don't think I've mentioned this before), I tried on one of the NoS BDB's on my last visit a couple of months ago, it was absolutely enormous, maybe that's why they're still sitting on the website.......
I hate Harry Hill style BD shirts, they look as daft as those tiny collars.
I don't care if the shirt is a vintage, NOS etc if it isn't in proportion to the person's size.
Denim shirts always say open neck, hairy grey chest and a chain to me - I've seen plenty.
One guy in my industry was known for them, thought he looked great and just got sniggers.
Last edited by An Unseen Scene (2022-12-21 08:38:48)
AUS is right. There’s plenty of guys out there in internet land showing off their huge collars. If it’s not in proportion it just looks daft.
The BDBaggies Stax refers to must be NOS from the early 90’s, when huge was the cut of choice. I’ve bought a few BDB’s recently and was surprised how ‘baggie’ they weren’t. I’d obviously missed that the baggie must refer to the bag they supply with them rather than the cut of the shirt.
2RS - I thought the denim ones looked very dark on their website. I suppose nothing that wearing and washing wouldn’t fix. Although too much of that could push them further into the denim shirt territory that AUS refers to?
I like the collars on the JS ivy shirts. But if I remember rightly, the madras 'jivy ivy' collars were verging on Harry Hill. I returned the latter but get much wear out of the former
Some time ago I was shopping with my brother in law and he wanted to buy a BD shirt. To my surprise he chose one with a small collar which I pointed out to him. His arguement was that as he only has a short neck it suited him. Perhaps we need to take neck length into account.
I only have one long collared BD, made in Italy. I regard it as continental and not Ivy.
I have mentioned proportion of collar to person for a few years here. I'm only 5' 6" so some of the deliberately long collar BDs can look wrong on me. They either look too tall or balloon outwards horizontally. A longer collar looks great with a tie on me, but some guidance to me by Mrs Unseen Scene is often advisable.
It is all part of the fun!
Last edited by An Unseen Scene (2022-12-22 04:54:14)
Any type of collar is good, short, long, buy whatever you like … unless your interested in an Ivy look
It’s all about the collar roll and if the collar points are too short or too long, or the collar buttons aren’t placed correctly, it doesn’t happen. Isn’t 3 1/4?? the ideal collar point length, Im not a tailor but surely it can’t be too difficult to get right?
A well proportioned collar (as found on Brooks shirts) should suit pretty much anyone unless they are at the extreme ends of shortness or tallness.
A well cut BD dress shirt in a lightweight denim cloth does not automatically turn you into Marlboro/Medallion Man, as ever it depends what else you are wearing it with.
Any type of collar is good, short, long, buy whatever you like … unless your interested in an Ivy look
It’s all about the collar roll and if the collar points are too short or too long, or the collar buttons aren’t placed correctly, it doesn’t happen. Isn’t 3 1/4 inches the ideal collar point length, I’m obviously not a tailor but surely it can’t be too difficult to get right?
A properly proportioned collar (as found on Brooks shirts) should suit anyone unless they are at the extreme ends of shortness or tallness.
A well cut BD dress shirt in a lightweight denim cloth does not automatically turn you into Marlboro/Medallion Man, as ever it depends what else you are wearing it with.
I think it is more that a certain age and mindset of men are attracted to denim shirts...Paul Hollywood style. Not the fault of the shirt. I stopped wearing denim of any kind at forty as a choice, which has worked well for me but we are all different.
Last edited by An Unseen Scene (2022-12-22 04:58:41)
FlatSixC makes a good point about collar button placing. Some longer collars don't even have a good collar roll. The collar roll is everything for me and even when I wear a tie the top button is never done up.
I still wear the Lee 101 jeans even though my immediate relatives frown if we meet up on a Friday night and they are wearing chinos, cords or mohair trousers and I'm in my jeans. I've kind of learnt my lesson and am wearing chinos more and more.
Last edited by RobbieB (2022-12-22 05:18:04)
Had an email from End this morning saying their sale is on, (as always), I checked what was on offer with Gitman shirts and to my surprise almost all of them are in the sale including Denim BD's, normally End hold back on the basics (white, blue, blue/white etc), but all bar the blue oxfords are in the sale and available in all sizes from what I can see, discounts are between 30% to 65%, there's 1 or 2 I like but I've got enough shirts ......
Stax- There are a few bargains on the End site re the Gitman shirts. Cheaper than JS at sale prices and better made. Luckily I'm not due back to UK till mid Jan.so will resist till then.
The male models on the End site don't wear the Gitman shirts well.
Stax - ‘ Had an email from End this morning saying their sale is on’
Quite like the look of the dark denim one which has tails, the sort of thing I had in mind when I wrote the post.
https://www.endclothing.com/gb/gitman-vintage-button-down-denim-shirt-vs19-d408-41.html
Last edited by FlatSixC (2022-12-22 09:47:28)
2RS has written about ‘throwing off the shackles of self consciousness’ and I’m with him, I wear pretty much what I like.
But I recognise the need to tread carefully with certain items as I’m in my sixties (for a little longer anyway). Worn with the right things and in the right setting I wouldn’t have any qualms about wearing a BD dress lightweight denim shirt or jeans, just not together.
AUS - I looked at Paul Hollywood and when he wear those shirts they tend to be washed out denim and worn with low waist skinny jeans, which look absurd on a man of his age. I agree, he looks a proper twat, but I wouldn’t mind his cash.