https://www.ivy-style.com/ivy-styles-new-editor-and-publisher-matthew-longcore.html

He's supposedly a friend of the present IS guy, which doesn't inspire confidence, regardless I think he'll do well.

A very charitable assessment of Burton. I've already stated my opinion of him on previous threads.

Chens was sometimes a bit clueless about ivy clothing but he had a good idea of how to make the site successful and was very diligent. However it was always obvious that ivy was an uncomfortable fit for him. He certainly had some good years though.

True to a certain extent however it went way deeper than that. To Chens, ivy's appeal was as a signifier of being part of the upper classes. Which has never been the ethos over here, and that used to disgust him. He also hated being associated with anything from the past, whereas many on here used to love a vintage ivy look.

Jim noted Chens' social-climbing ambitions and lack of subject knowledge of ivy clothing, and took the piss out of them. Relentless provocation? That's an understatement ha. Jim took it to an obsessive extreme, presumably as a result of his inner demons. But as I recall, it didn't take long for Chens' negativity towards Brits (and certain non-Brit posters on here) to manifest itself. In fact his thin-skinned nature was another of his weaknesses.

Chens was also encouraged by various posters on his comments pages who also found this forum disgusting. And there was a political side to all this which I won't get into.

Last edited by Yuca (2024-06-29 03:39:06)

^^ and funnily enough, where it seems our friends across the ponds are often seduced by those old inherited/reworked rules and class traditions, the 'coolness' of the ivy look - as I see it -was something of a subtle rejection of them, as embodied perfectly in the natural shoulder jacket and slouchy sack cut, that clothes were well-worn, crumpled, comfortable, not flashy, not-quite-so-easy to place. On that final point, I rarely talk about clothes with people (...there's far more important things to worry about...) but when it comes up, it's always fascinating how the ivy look can't be easily pinned down, familiar but not, smart but relaxed, subtle yet different

Last edited by colin (2024-07-02 06:15:43)

"He simply refused to comprehend that in the UK an interest in Ivy clothing doesn't stem from elite colleges or the upper class. It's actually an interest fuelled simply by liking the style."

He understood that very well. He just didn't like it. And he could explain that very well. That didn't suit the British here because they claimed sovereignty over interpretation for themselves. It was a mutual intolerance.

I can understand his point of view as well as the British one.

Ivy (and also Preppy) were originally the lifestyle of a very specific social group in the USA and still are today. To deny that is absurd. This lifestyle has never been “inclusive??  and never will be.

The style has a completely different history in Britain, becoming popular through working-class subcultures. For obvious reasons, the associated lifestyle did not play a role in these circles. The British equivalent of Ivy/Preppy in England in terms of class would have been the Sloane Rangers.

One could simply accept that there are these different approaches/interpretations. But maybe that would be too easy?