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#1 2008-04-23 19:43:01

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

http://www.chowhound.com/topics/368135


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#2 2008-04-23 20:22:55

tom22
Member
Posts: 295

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

I'm not a New Yorker so I am not up to date on these places. The last time I went to the 21 Club a jacket and tie were required. They actually sent you an email telling you about the dress code. i was tempted to send one back saying that I hoped that their code measured up to my standards. But i was too lazy.
The Harvard Club the last time I was there still required ties and would give you one if you didn't arrive properly dressed.  I think a tie is no longer required at the Yale Club. Are there other places in the big City?

 

#3 2008-04-23 22:06:09

Coolidge
Member
Posts: 1192

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

"It's over all too soon, only an hour or so, but for that brief shining space of time I've traveled far far away from the gritty New York streets and been a part of a purer, golden world, and when I emerge from that space I feel cosseted and validated and loved."

^ That's a feeling I've had.  And I've gotten it as well in other similar situations...theater/musicals/symphony performances where everybody's still pretty much expected to look good (though some still get in without, to be sure), the spring ball with the big band at my college where "elegant attire" was required and campus safety would actually block anyone from entering who was not at least wearing jacket and tie,  a certain hotel bar on the shore with a Bobby Short imitator, or even watching the scene in the 1982 movie "My Favorite Year" where the maitre'd  at the Stork Club greets Peter O'Toole, while firmly steering bomber-jacket clad Mark Linn-Baker towards the coat check girl saying "a proper jacket, please."  It adds to the value of the experience in some way...mostly intangible but that quote does make a good shot at describing it.

A sense of situational appropriateness is really something I can appreciate. It really doesn't fit well with the postmodern view of life, where there is often no such concept.

Though I suppose there is another pleasure inherent in such activities.  One comment replying to the link Marc posted says her husband is "really uncomfortable in suits" so they don't go to places where they're required. I take a largely private and unexpressed joy in creating or being a part of situations where people who are uncomfortable in suits feel uneasy.  Not so much in the professional as social environment.

 

#4 2008-04-23 23:11:12

Coolidge
Member
Posts: 1192

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

In answer to Tom's question by the way, I am fairly certain the Rainbow Room still requires black tie for the weekend dances, and that the Cafe Carlyle requires jacket and tie as well.

 

#5 2008-04-24 07:10:51

Horace
Member
Posts: 6433

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi


""This is probably the last Deb season...because of the stock market, the economy, Everything..." - W. Stillman.

 

#6 2008-04-24 07:51:35

Tony Ventresca
Member
Posts: 5132

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

 

#7 2008-04-24 10:09:47

captainpreppy
Member
Posts: 1536

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

I noticed in the comments in the link it looked as if there were quite a few Cruisers and maybe a Kav or two (as in the lady who told about how the waiter smashed a tray of glasses on her boyfriend's head after he took off his jacket at the table).

Taking the jacket off at the table (except maybe in stifling heat) is a practice I just despise. Somewhile back my wife and I were at the finest restaurant in our city, and I noticed a large percentage of the men had done just that. I don't know why: If they were flush enough to eat there, they could damn well afford jackets that fit...or pay the dry cleaning bill if they were piggish enough to spill food on them. I am honestly at a loss to conceive of any other reason why a man should remove his jacket at the table.

 

#8 2008-04-24 10:17:56

Voltaire's Bastard
Member
Posts: 967

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi


“You know that saying, 'Caesar's wife is above suspicion'? Well I put an end to all that rubbish!"..”

 

#9 2008-04-24 10:51:32

Marc Grayson
Member
Posts: 8860

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

Four Seasons restaurant.  One of the owners, Alex von Bidder, IIRC, has his suits made by Andrew Ramroop on Savile Row.


"‘The sense of being perfectly well dressed gives a feeling of inner tranquility which even religion is powerless to bestow." Ralph Waldo Emerson
"Looking good and dressing well is a necessity. Having a purpose in life is not."  Oscar Wilde

 

#10 2008-04-24 11:38:23

captainpreppy
Member
Posts: 1536

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

 

#11 2008-04-24 12:35:25

Incroyable
Member
Posts: 2310

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

These self-righteous proclamations are appalling:

"We are a generation of casual diners," she said, "bred to enjoy good food in a relaxed setting... old world regulations just don't work in this millenium."

I envision someone in mid-range sunglasses, talking on their cell-phones, with a hybrid car outside, dining at an expensive restaurant.

Last edited by Incroyable (2008-04-24 12:36:09)


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#12 2008-04-24 13:37:48

Voltaire's Bastard
Member
Posts: 967

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi


“You know that saying, 'Caesar's wife is above suspicion'? Well I put an end to all that rubbish!"..”

 

#13 2008-04-24 14:20:47

Admiral Cod
Member
Posts: 412

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi


"You will find that men of style and their adherents are considered either political enemies of the people or reckless, gluttoness consumers while most live in squalor" - FNB

 

#14 2008-04-24 14:56:56

Film Noir Buff
Dandy Nightmare
From: Devil's Island
Posts: 9345

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

I dont know why men dont wear more jackets. The idea that jackets are for jerks is gone, I think replaced by massive insecurity about where to get a nice jacket. I havent seen anyone (normal) act negatively towards a jacket, even college people like clothes and suits.

Take the NFL Draft, many of them are getting custom suits for the event. Why dont they just show up in hoodies? Would the teams care? theyd still make mint off of them.


I would love the statistics of how many ties, shirts, suits are bought each year. However, as I touched on above, i dont think if it's dwindling that it's necessarily  a matter of waning interest, I think there is a disconnect between maker and buyer. Further, There exist few mainstream images for men to get tailored clothes; clothes always seem to have to have an angle...or a lifestyle.

One interesting excahnge with a college girl from a relatively modest background from Upstate NY. I assumed she would think a man in a suit was a jerk but she loved the idea of men in suits.

Is the suit and the jacket doomed? Generally there must exist a replacement. I think a lot of the new, finer materials save the tailored jacket. No idea what sort of lifestyle men getting 15 oz suits lead but for men that have to deal with contingencies, stress, or activity in most heated office buildings, heavy weeight suits are incredibly uncomfortable.

 

#15 2008-04-24 16:11:05

I Should Be Working
Member
Posts: 107

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

I think restaurants are better off these days handling this topic with a softer touch.  Much as we might like to see slobs clothes-lined at the door, social trends and economics often hit a restaurant too hard. 

The house coat is great idea.  It should fit reasonably well so as the patron may eat without undue interference, but could be visually set apart.  Maybe a bright kelly green for them all.  How about some downright awful thrifted jackets?  This would introduce a bit of humor into the affair, and might even encourage people not to take themselves so seriously.  If people insist on acting like juveniles, then initiate them into adulthood like any other pledge, newbie, freshman, or what have you.

A restaurant can also have different seating sections.  Put the man-child in a room with a big TV.  He won't notice a thing.

 

#16 2008-04-24 16:42:20

Coolidge
Member
Posts: 1192

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

 

#17 2008-04-24 16:44:11

iammatt
Member
Posts: 520

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

 

#18 2008-04-24 17:00:23

Voltaire's Bastard
Member
Posts: 967

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi


“You know that saying, 'Caesar's wife is above suspicion'? Well I put an end to all that rubbish!"..”

 

#19 2008-04-24 21:02:22

Incroyable
Member
Posts: 2310

Re: Jacket & Tie Required: Vox Populi

Last edited by Incroyable (2008-04-24 21:02:40)


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