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#26 2009-04-03 08:12:33
- chetmiles
- Member
- Posts: 1099
Re: The Cultural Divide?
Italy? Now that's what I call architecture, GG!
#30 2009-04-03 11:10:54
- Taylor McIntyre
- Son of Ivy...
- Posts: 342
Re: The Cultural Divide?
I'm with you.
These things are fun to chat about online but at the end of the day putting on some soothing music & kicking off your loafers matters much more.
Hope I get laid tonight.
#32 2009-04-03 11:25:21
- Taylor McIntyre
- Son of Ivy...
- Posts: 342
Re: The Cultural Divide?
I promise not to think of you & your kind words if it happens. 
To be honest my back is murder just now after fooling around in the attic yesterday. I suspect I shall fall asleep by the fire instead... I really am turning into Harris...
#33 2009-04-03 21:41:14
- 3buttonMax
- Member
- Posts: 19
Re: The Cultural Divide?
interesting thread... Ivy ,seems to be all embracing-the big tent, a 3 button sack suit from 1925 or a sack from the 60s.-- some sacks from the 60s have moderate lapels which if pressed for a 3 to a buttoned 2 roll are perfectly wearable-the mass marketed high fashion Ivy of the 60s (60s tv comes to mind) seems somewhat costume like(quite possibly because I remember it)-
I would be curious to know when the 3rolled down to a 2 came about-
any informants?
to touch on Russ streets comment-
there has been a whole RL influence - the real genesis of "trad"??and limiting...
which doesnt see the real history from the early 20s on- I kind of like drawing on the best from an 85 year perspective-some of it preference some borne of sheer economy.
I find the debate or confab interesting-...
#34 2009-04-03 21:43:46
- BulldogNH
- Member
- Posts: 200
Re: The Cultural Divide?
I don't know when the 3/2 came in, but it appears in some of the Apparel Arts odd jackets depictions from the 30s.
#35 2009-04-03 22:01:12
- 3buttonMax
- Member
- Posts: 19
Re: The Cultural Divide?
thanks bulldog- in some 20s pics the gents havent buttoned the top button ,by design or accident i am not sure.
again much enjoyed your blog some time ago and glad you are here.
max
#36 2009-04-04 01:45:16
- Taylor McIntyre
- Son of Ivy...
- Posts: 342
Re: The Cultural Divide?
There is a great 1920 pic of a young Harvard buck in a 3/4 roll on here somewhere. It's Spring/Summer in the shot & the suit doesn't look new. It's very English in style, but the lapel roll is clearly there along with the natural shoulders. I'll see if I can find it. It shows that this styling detail was there already in, let's say, 1918 / 1919.
Probably we always suspected this, but having a dated photograph makes all the difference.
Best -
#40 2009-04-04 14:43:13
- ScarletStreet
- Member
- Posts: 540
Re: The Cultural Divide?
I was just rereading this thread and caught the Bad Religion reference...I never thought about it in terms of all this business but the lyrics do certainly sum all this up. I think this goes back to my point in another thread. So many Americans seem to have to find an answer, they have to find a message, a plan, a messiah. Everything has to prepackaged and make sense in some specific context. It's frustrating, and if someone in this country lets themselves worry about the trads, preppies, american heritage hipsters etc. they will become increasingly neurotic about the clothes they wear. The "message they convey". It's a little much to take some times. "everyone begging for an Answer without regard to validity, the searching never ends it goes on for eternity....but if you've got enough naivete and you've got enough conviction then the answer is perfect for you"
"All men are frauds. The only difference between them is that some admit it. I myself deny it." -- H.L. Mencken
#42 2009-04-05 01:04:27
- Taylor McIntyre
- Son of Ivy...
- Posts: 342
Re: The Cultural Divide?
That's the pic! Many thanks, BoO.
I bet you're right. If the roll was there in Edwardian times then it's a safe bet that it was also a Victorian commonplace.