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#1 2009-05-28 02:03:08

Ian Strachan's Raincoat
Member
Posts: 521

Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

Paddy has written to me of this process taking place, and, reading between the lines to some extent, I have found allusions to it elsewhere - in relation to furniture, for instance. 
This is where Modernist theorising and I tend to part company, and my inherently reactionary nature comes to the fore - if only in a naked attempt to bring Big John Gall out of hiding. 
It does and it doesn't.  There's nothing very 'democratic' about the prices in the Andover Shop catalogue, is there?  Or Press, if it comes to that?  What can you afford in John's on your wages or pocket money?  A tie?  A three-pack of Fruit of the Loom t-shirts?  What could the average lad have afforded in Austins, Cecil Gee or Austin Reed? 
In England, amongst at least some men I have known, 'democratization' was only tolerable from maybe one Saturday afternoon to the next, and then they moved on.  Casual style followed an extraordinarily elitist pattern, too, the idea being to display more wealth on your back than the guy standing next to you. 
This sounds very much as though I'm only talking in terms of money, but it's far more complex than that, isn't it?  In fact, thinking about it, if I were to buy a Viyella buttondown from the Andover Shop at their prices, would it last me half as long as the one that came from a local charity shop?  I actually dislike spending too much money - not that I have it to spend - but whether you do or you don't splash out nothing should look too pristine, right?  Yet there's nothing 'democratic' about beating up a jacket to make it look more worn-in than it really is - that gesture has more than a touch of elitism in it. 

This may be why I prefer Ercol over Eames, or some unknown small town architect over Le Corbusier or Philip Johnson.  I'd rather see ivy on mellow stone than stained concrete pillars - and that's 'Ivy', isn't it?  Modernism and Ivy don't always go together. 

Waits for jeers and cat calls.

 

#2 2009-05-28 03:28:56

1966
1,966% Ivy
Posts: 2382

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

Last edited by 1966 (2009-05-28 03:30:23)

 

#3 2009-05-28 03:57:02

heikki k
The Ivyist's Ivyist
Posts: 1442

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

also, that happened - say - on le corbusier as well: his furniture became sought-after design items whereas his architectural ideas distorted into what we now know as brutalism. good intentions and reality very seldom walk the same path.

Last edited by heikki k (2009-05-28 03:57:29)

 

#4 2009-05-28 04:03:02

Ian Strachan's Raincoat
Member
Posts: 521

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

 

#5 2009-05-28 04:19:58

Natural Sole Brother
Ivy, naturally.
Posts: 782

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

One can never take apparel out of its historical, geographical and psycho-social context. In the north-eastern US in the so-called boom years the look was very much a product of democratisation in many senses, not least a democratisation of access to higher education and unlocking doors which had been barred in real and implied senses for generations: part of a wider pattern of assimilation and homogenisation in US society at the time.

It became mass market stuff and the default look (albeit in a somewhat inevitably diluted form) for a broad sector of the population for almost a generation.

A discussion of Ivy in the UK with regard to ideas of 'democracy' would yield almost completely the opposite responses.

'Ivy' in the UK at the same time was presumably about a completely different set of imperatives: not blending in; being an outsider; proclaiming difference.

Here it was never mass market: tiny aspects of it may have become so over time, but I would have thought that the predominant ideology for the UK Ivy-ist (if such an ideology exists at all) has been to separate one's self from a perceived mainstream.

Last edited by Natural Sole Brother (2009-05-28 05:10:28)

 

#6 2009-05-28 04:21:21

Natural Sole Brother
Ivy, naturally.
Posts: 782

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

To add to the above I suppose it's fair to say that, for me at least, dressing this way is very much about adopting a costume.

 

#7 2009-05-28 04:23:13

Ian Strachan's Raincoat
Member
Posts: 521

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

 

#8 2009-05-28 04:48:58

1966
1,966% Ivy
Posts: 2382

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

 

#9 2009-05-28 04:54:13

Ian Strachan's Raincoat
Member
Posts: 521

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

But he doesn't know it is.

 

#10 2009-05-28 04:59:33

1966
1,966% Ivy
Posts: 2382

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

Last edited by 1966 (2009-05-28 05:01:39)

 

#11 2009-05-28 06:00:48

1966
1,966% Ivy
Posts: 2382

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

 

#12 2009-05-29 01:46:47

Suitedbooted2000
Member
Posts: 577

Re: Some thoughts on the 'democratization' of Ivy

 
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